It seems like the stakes continue to rise with each protest. These people seem so determined to have their way, that they don’t mind inciting a war or destroying society in the process. You won’t get others to care about the problem you are protecting unless you appeal to the heart of others. Disrupting traffic and all of the other bad actions make them look like spoiled kids throwing a temper tantrum.
So, do you have a bad guy doing bad stuff with a gun in a crappy part of town who refuses police orders and finally opens fire on them?
Or...
Do you have a guy driving around the crappy neighborhood he lives in, who gets pulled over by what he thinks is a cop, but what gets out isn't wearing a uniform and draws a gun on him in a few seconds, so he decides to shoot it out instead of give in?
I honestly don't know the answer nor do I think I ever will. I wish I had enough faith in our institutions to say that I had confidence that the system would seek the truth, but I don't.
While that may be true, you can't know that the cops didn't identify themselves as cops. It seems to me that's likely to have been the first thing they'd have done.
The group of officers was integrated, and there was at least one female officer. That doesn't sound like a gang out looking for trouble.
I agree. I'm not saying they didn't, but if there was body-camera footage that indicated they did, CPD would have released it. Based on the totality of the circumstances, this appears to be a good shoot. But...
I can't help but ask how I would react if I was driving around in a high-crime part of town, was pulled over by someone I thought was a cop, the 4 people who got out of the car weren't wearing uniforms and they drew on me within a few seconds. How might you react?
I hope I'd at least yell, "Are you cops?!?!" I know, I know, the stress, but still, with five, and as I said, integrated, and one a woman, it would have seemed to me a good guess.
Really, the guy's behavior makes no sense, at all. And what in the world did he start rolling up the window for?
In the summer of 2005, I looked casually out through my living room window. I saw several men with rifles aimed at the house across the street. I don't remember that I saw police vehicles, or that the men had anything on their uniforms which indicated "police," but I sort of gathered instantly that that was the case. ( It was. The developmentally disabled man who lived with his mother in that house had just beaten her to death. )
This may be nitpicking, but a lot of BLM protests blocked roads, too.
I sadly agree on your analysis, though. We should be allowed to run them over if there is no viable escape and if they are warned ONCE. It is indeed false imprisonment at the very least, and we have the right to free ourselves with all necessary force. But who wants to go through what Kyle Rittenhouse went through?
In general squaring off against a mob is a terrible idea, regardless of the circumstances. That's why "stay away from large crowds" is good advice.
I'm finding that cops engage in some incredibly reckless behavior that puts both themselves and the citizenry at tremendous risk. If you have to guess whether someone's an actual cop or not, then your tactics need to be re-examined. Hence, the "no-knock warrant" controversy. I think the only situation where a no-knock entry is made is in a hostage situation or where someone's life is clearly, obviously in danger. Otherwise, making someone guess whether it's an intruder or a cop is such a stupidly dangerous game to play.
It seems like the stakes continue to rise with each protest. These people seem so determined to have their way, that they don’t mind inciting a war or destroying society in the process. You won’t get others to care about the problem you are protecting unless you appeal to the heart of others. Disrupting traffic and all of the other bad actions make them look like spoiled kids throwing a temper tantrum.
Dexter is a lousy martyr, but so was George Floyd. However, I do have concerns with the video (and I watched all 5 of them on the Chicago PD website).
1) These are plainclothes officers. No unis.
2) I don't hear anyone identify themselves as cops. The audio starts late in each case, but no one identifies themselves as far as I can tell.
3) This is a dangerous part of town. (https://crimegrade.org/safest-places-in-humboldt-park-chicago-il/) That affects both cops and the perp.
So, do you have a bad guy doing bad stuff with a gun in a crappy part of town who refuses police orders and finally opens fire on them?
Or...
Do you have a guy driving around the crappy neighborhood he lives in, who gets pulled over by what he thinks is a cop, but what gets out isn't wearing a uniform and draws a gun on him in a few seconds, so he decides to shoot it out instead of give in?
I honestly don't know the answer nor do I think I ever will. I wish I had enough faith in our institutions to say that I had confidence that the system would seek the truth, but I don't.
While that may be true, you can't know that the cops didn't identify themselves as cops. It seems to me that's likely to have been the first thing they'd have done.
The group of officers was integrated, and there was at least one female officer. That doesn't sound like a gang out looking for trouble.
I agree. I'm not saying they didn't, but if there was body-camera footage that indicated they did, CPD would have released it. Based on the totality of the circumstances, this appears to be a good shoot. But...
I can't help but ask how I would react if I was driving around in a high-crime part of town, was pulled over by someone I thought was a cop, the 4 people who got out of the car weren't wearing uniforms and they drew on me within a few seconds. How might you react?
I hope I'd at least yell, "Are you cops?!?!" I know, I know, the stress, but still, with five, and as I said, integrated, and one a woman, it would have seemed to me a good guess.
Really, the guy's behavior makes no sense, at all. And what in the world did he start rolling up the window for?
In the summer of 2005, I looked casually out through my living room window. I saw several men with rifles aimed at the house across the street. I don't remember that I saw police vehicles, or that the men had anything on their uniforms which indicated "police," but I sort of gathered instantly that that was the case. ( It was. The developmentally disabled man who lived with his mother in that house had just beaten her to death. )
This may be nitpicking, but a lot of BLM protests blocked roads, too.
I sadly agree on your analysis, though. We should be allowed to run them over if there is no viable escape and if they are warned ONCE. It is indeed false imprisonment at the very least, and we have the right to free ourselves with all necessary force. But who wants to go through what Kyle Rittenhouse went through?
In general squaring off against a mob is a terrible idea, regardless of the circumstances. That's why "stay away from large crowds" is good advice.
I'm finding that cops engage in some incredibly reckless behavior that puts both themselves and the citizenry at tremendous risk. If you have to guess whether someone's an actual cop or not, then your tactics need to be re-examined. Hence, the "no-knock warrant" controversy. I think the only situation where a no-knock entry is made is in a hostage situation or where someone's life is clearly, obviously in danger. Otherwise, making someone guess whether it's an intruder or a cop is such a stupidly dangerous game to play.